The Tyranny Of The Law

[friendstacy]

hahahahahaha that was real funny, Ian. LOL

perfectly illustrates my point, though. you got this one group (represented by a fictional character called, of all things, Jack Straw - ROFLMAO) at odds with this other group calling themselves Libertarians (when the word liberty has been historically used by those in power to limit our freedoms while they tell us it means the opposite of that). the symbolism alone, the emotional triggers, are so thick and so obviously hidden in plain view! why is it so many still refuse to see?

so tell me, Ian, because i most certainly don't understand. why should someone join your organization? why should they give their power, their freedom, away, in order to be part of something that has a snowball's chance in hell of ever helping anyone to truly be free? why? fear is no answer, nor are threats. let's dispell with that before we begin. i'm seriously interested in your *personal* philosophy of such things, seeing as how my perspective (an anarchist from the states) is so vastly different from yours. i do believe we have much to learn from our differences, if you would oblige.

thanks

[IanPJ]

I cannot believe that you feel that as an individual you can ignore the rolling tide of dictatorship. You believe that you can honestly just 'opt out'.

That may well have been the case whilst life was rolling along normally, government was just dealing with the majority of people in the way it always had, whilst it was using law, because as an individual it was easier and less problematic just to ignore you.

Now they are introducing new laws, and constitutions, and rules that say, if you don't do what we want we can shoot you, we can dispossess you, we can stop your life. Government has now become lawless.

You cannot opt out of that, because when government decides that the laws you wish to use and live by don't exist any more, they will come for you anyway. If you are happy that you may well end up free in mind but in prison, or even worse lose your life, then fine, but for me (and i can only speak for myself), I want to carry on living, and I want my children to grow up in a land that is free from governmental tyranny.

So I work to change the way in which the political system works, rather than the anarchist view that there just shouldn't be any government at all.

Before you can get to your position, you have to pass through mine first.

[friendstacy]

who said?
you said

You believe that you can honestly just 'opt out'.

wrong. that is not what i believe nor is it what i have stated here or anywhere else, ever.

let's start there, then.

and while you're at it, please help me understand this:

whilst life was rolling along normally

when was that, exactly, pray tell?

Now they are introducing new laws, and constitutions, and rules that say, if you don't do what we want we can shoot you, we can dispossess you, we can stop your life. Government has now become lawless.

same as it ever was. show me how and when it was ever any different!!

they will come for you anyway.

that very well may be. threats of horrible punishments cannot turn me into a docile sheep, or quiet my voice, because that is in contrast to what my inner spirit tells me i must do. if they wanted me in jail, or dead, for that matter, i'd already be there. and what good would it do their cause? to get rid of some housewife in tennessee that isn't bothering anyone. imagine some faceless army marching up the street bearing machine guns, coming to take me and my children away, what a joke! how could they possibly spin that into anything other than a hollywood fairy tale that the public would never buy. it is not my decision to make, what anyone else might choose to do. what is my responsibility is to decide for myself (without fear of any threats) whether to continue to live in fear and remain silent, or to speak out, at the top of my lungs, if i have to. i choose to believe that i am making a difference, not by giving my power to some group in the hopes that the group has my best interests at heart, but by standing alone and using my power to change my world in a way that benefits everyone, and not just a select few who are members of the right group.

edit to add:
the group has only the "good of the group" as its goal and purpose. that is how the groupthink mindcontrol works. and we don't like those words, do we? no, we don't. words like that makes us cringe, makes us cower in fear, don't they? the group tells you that individually, you are weak and pitiful and you need someone else to help you, to teach you, to lead you, to give you the right answers, because you aren't worthy of making any decisions for yourself. when you join the group, you give up your right to disagree with the majority, regardless how foolish it might be what the majority thinks. my version of anarchy is the opposite of that. it's each individual human being, no matter who they are, believing in themselves. freedom means that we get to make our own decisions for ourselves. autonomy. it means that no group, no organization, be that in the form of church or state, has higher authority than each individual's own innermost guide.

and society tells us we are wrong to believe in ourselves. we need the system. we have been so sorely abused by authority that we lose touch with that inner voice, we forget how strong we are. but there's lots and lots starting to remember. because the only way world peace will ever happen is for all of us to stand up, alone, individually, for everyone else's right to do the same.

[friendstacy]

So I work to change the way in which the political system works, rather than the anarchist view that there just shouldn't be any government at all.

Before you can get to your position, you have to pass through mine first.

problem is, the political system does not work. it never has, except to benefit the few at the very tippy top of that pyramid. we want to think it works, don't we? we want to believe in the "american dream" (sure you all have something similar on that side of the pond, don't you? that if we play their game well enough, we can come out on top ...well, never all the way to the top, but we can "succeed" - we can rise above).

so we are divided up into groups, building blocks, as it were, to support the pyramid, the heirarchy of power and control. and the higher up that pyramid we go, the more people we step upon for personal advance, the more we think we are better than them, those who are "beneath" us. a pyramid made entirely of sand would never support its own weight. the sand has to be mixed with lime and aggregate, made into concrete first. and how is this accomplished? mostly with what is popularly known as "education" - indoctrination into the system of control and abuse. and we are told that we should believe the good of the group comes first, and our individual freedoms matter not.

if i am to pass through your position, i need to understand it better. you never answered my questions.

[dave]

seeing as how my perspective (an anarchist from the states) is so vastly different from yours

I wanted to post something here in relation to words, my own interpretation of them simply as 'a man on the street'. With tryanny and oppression words are an important weapon and the meaning of words are changed for political (abusive) purposes, for Mrs Windsor and company for example war = peace and similar lies. As we think in words, our thoughts are corrupted by the nonsense espoused by the crown and their media.

The meaning of the word anarchist in the minds of the people was changed long before we were born to suggest something rather harmful. An anarchist believes in freedom, that is the individual is responsible for their own lives. With a dictatorship (dictator = that which says the words), government being one of the forms of it, those that work of the government are employees of the state and are by assertion the state bound by its (it as in a thing as the state is a fictional entity) rules. That Roman (dictatorship) structure is known as STATe, the laws that apply to those that work for the state are STATutory laws. Those that are responsible for their own lives rather than accepting what has been decided for them are not bound by those laws and the state has no jurisdiction (spoken word) over them though it is in any event just words.

To give an example of a real anarchist 'state' it is this discussion board, you don't have to surrender your will to post here and vested interests and voices of conscience have expressed themselves. Alternatively there is the state's media who are there to create public opinion rather than allow it to be heard. The word anarchist was deliberately discredited for and by the dictator but if one is radical (gets to the root of the problem and is paranoid (able to find what joins different events) then one would realise that a new born baby born outside of slavery is an anarchist. As I am genuinely trying to express the views that I have they are free (anarchist) views.

Such is the world, people are corrupted by and frightened of words without knowing their true meaning, thus the more security that is tolerated by people the greater the danger.

[dave]

For an example of the influence of the crown's media:

"Sixty-four years ago this month, six million Americans became unwitting subjects in an experiment in psychological warfare.

It was the night before Halloween, 1938. At 8 p.m. CST, the Mercury Radio on the Air began broadcasting Orson Welles' radio adaptation of H. G. Wells' War of the Worlds. As is now well known, the story was presented as if it were breaking news, with bulletins so realistic that an estimated one million people believed the world was actually under attack by Martians. "
...
"Perhaps it is no coincidence that H. G. Wells was a founding member of the Round Table, the think tank that gave birth to the Royal Institute for International Affairs (RIIA) and its American cousin, the CFR. Perhaps Wells intentionally introduced the motif as a meme which might prove useful later in establishing the "world social democracy" he described in his 1939 book The New World Order. "

http://www.informationliberation.com/index.php?id=25167